Import dimensions from Parts Studio

nav

When designing in parts studio the usual workflow is to fully define all dimensions in sketches/features, It would be nice like in other CAD packages, that OS drawings had the ability to bring in dimensions to our drawings from the parts studio automatically to save some time.

3dcad

I think this is almost useles if it imports all dimensions (like other packages do). Deleting unnecessary takes almost same time than adding the needed dimension.

What if we try to think output while creating model and put in check box option 'drawing dimension' to sketch/extrude dimension dialogs. Then import only those dimension which have option checked.

What do you guys think?

_Ðave_

Personally I would just put in the dimensions has/where I need and never use such an option.

nav

@3dcad @da_vicki I agree you have a good point there, just going over some sample drawings from tooling we have I`ve asked our engineers and they always put in the dimension and don`t use the feature import dimensions from part.

brucebartlett

I would not waste time with importing dimensions from part studios. Very rarely do you end up with the right dimensions especially with multi-body design.

andrew_troup

I personally think that this functionality, in other packages, gets used mainly by CAD sales people.
It's very useful when providing impressive demos, using carefully pre-modelled parts, to people who sign cheques and budgets rather than produce drawings.

3dcad

How could we make such feature useful? Or is there any options for automate dimensioning in drawing?
I hate manual dimensioning in drawings..

brucebartlett

Import dimensions may allow you to adjust a dimensions from a drawing.  In SW's, adjustment can only take place from drawings when they are imported otherwise you have to return to the model. 

In my mind However I think it's safer to return to the model to make dimensional adjustments. 

stg434

brucebartlett said:

Import dimensions may allow you to adjust a dimensions from a drawing.  In SW's, adjustment can only take place from drawings when they are imported otherwise you have to return to the model. 

In my mind However I think it's safer to return to the model to make dimensional adjustments. 

I never did like the idea of drawing dimensions changing the model - I even get nervous changing part designs from the assembly - I do it but, I'm usually gritting my teeth.  The Import Dims, as has been mentioned, isn't a big deal for my workflow.  I prefer to detail at myself - old school!

shashank_aarya

I would like to share some information about functionality of importing the dimensions from part in Creo (formerly known as Pro-Engineer). While modelling I prefer adding maximum features, sketch dimensions as per necessary dimensional control to manufacture the part, so that when drawing views are added I can import those dimensions directly. Initially it is not a simple process since we need to adjust the dimensions for their proper location but it gives some advantages in later stage as below.
1) Part can be directly updated by changing the dimension in drawing since the particular dimension is imported from part. So, no need open the part, no need to scroll the model tree to find that particular feature or sketch.
2) Imported dimensions doesn't get permanently deleted, so giving some protection to drawing data. Whenever same is required again we can retrieve it by "Show" option and it will be displayed at same location where it was adjusted before. So, no need of giving dimension again.

 

peter_hall

I also prefer to dimension in the drawing selectively, not have the dimensions imported. One side issue on tolerances though, when I put a tolerance on the dimension of say +/- 0.05 on a 98.0 dimension then I would like it shown as 98 +/- 0.05 it seems Onshape gives the dimension as 97.95 to 98.05
I know its the same thing, but I dont like the look of it.

3dcad

Maybe a separate tool for importing dimensions which would work so that when tool is selected and you hover on certain areas it shows possible dimension to import and if you click on that dimension it would pop in traveling with mouse so you could instantly have correct position and click again to proceed..?

I like dimensions associating with model but of course we need option to override actual values.

+1 for @peter_hall tolerance display issue

christopher_quijano

In my process, our drawings primarily show inspection dimensions and most non critical features are not dimensioned. Also we tend to control our drawings by GD&T and not +- dimensioning. How about creating needed dimensions in the drawing but allow GD&T to be applied to the 3D part or the 2D drawing.

valentin_coman

if you are an engineer make your parts like they do it in the shop. always use fully defined sketches and dimension them with the lathe or the mill in mind. then import those dimensions in your drawings. anything else is just kids playing video games.

brucebartlett

@valentin_coman I agree you need to have things dimensioned to make it easy to manufacture but I find lot of the time the dimensions used to model in 3d are not the most Ideal for the shop floor so therefore find I end up deleting them and adding more relevant one's in the drawing. 

I think it becomes even becomes harder in the multi body studio to get usable dimensions which are able to transfer to the drawing as part's tend to reference of each other and not themselves. This is also true in top down modelling in assemblies with other CAD products. 

3dcad

What do you people think of simple check box 'Show dimension in drawings' when adding values in sketcher / extrusion dialogs?

I agree that it is not always (ever) good to import all dimensions, but I don't like to repeat myself with simple stuff where you create sketch, model and drawing in one session and need to dimension same stuff twice..

andrew_troup

I guess I would prefer to be able to turn off that capabiity (to keep the interface clean)
I've personally never used that facility in modellers which offer it, having given it a fair trial.

 I found it (ie, thinking ahead to the drawing) slowed me down and distracted me while modelling and in any case I always ended up having to drag most of the dimensions on drawing views to a different location, which takes virtually as long as creating them from scratch (or worse yet, some dims would often import to the wrong view) 

It just never seemed to live up to the promise, for me.

brucebartlett

andrew_troup said:

I guess I would prefer to be able to turn off that capabiity (to keep the interface clean)
I've personally never used that facility in modellers which offer it, having given it a fair trial.

 I found it slowed me down and distracted me while modelling (thinking ahead to the drawing) and in any case I always ended up having to drag most of the dimensions on drawing views to a different location, which takes virtually as long as creating them from scratch (or worse yet, some dims would often import to the wrong view) 

It just never seemed to live up to the promise, for me.

That has been my experience too. 

3dcad

I have similar history with Alibre's import dimension feature.
Maybe we first need to push Onshape to work on smart dimension tool and this conversation will probably disappear by itself..

I have one more argument though. If you import dimensions, you could also import parameters and run model from drawing view. Changing other than original sketch dimensions would probably break the model.
This is not always needed, but I have also models where I wouldn't need to access the model itself ever if I could just change parameters and confirm that it prints ok in drawing view.

shashank_aarya

valentin_coman said:

if you are an engineer make your parts like they do it in the shop. always use fully defined sketches and dimension them with the lathe or the mill in mind. then import those dimensions in your drawings. anything else is just kids playing video games.

+1 for this. I always use this practice in Creo so that it is not required to return to the model and scroll to find the feature where it needs modification. Once drawing dimension is changed it will automatically update in associated 3D model. It is also known as two way associative nature (model to drawing and drawing to model).
I agree that it could be painful task initially while importing the dimensions but very helpful and time saving whenever any modification/revision is required in later stages after completing the drawing.

pete_yodis

shashank_aarya said:

valentin_coman said:

if you are an engineer make your parts like they do it in the shop. always use fully defined sketches and dimension them with the lathe or the mill in mind. then import those dimensions in your drawings. anything else is just kids playing video games.

+1 for this. I always use this practice in Creo so that it is not required to return to the model and scroll to find the feature where it needs modification. Once drawing dimension is changed it will automatically update in associated 3D model. It is also known as two way associative nature (model to drawing and drawing to model).
I agree that it could be painful task initially while importing the dimensions but very helpful and time saving whenever any modification/revision is required in later stages after completing the drawing.

For more simplistic models that may be the case, but where models tend to be more complex in nature I've found it can be very dangerous to allow that bi-directional edit.  A simple change from the drawing may not make someone editing the model aware of all the downstream changes if what is changed is affecting numerous other features/dimensions.

clay_ferriola

If you can change a dimension in the drawing and NOT in the model at the same time, then the system is not parametric.
I design and build complex machinery for a living and have been for 30 years. I ALWAYS import dimensions from the models in my drawings, and ALWAYS expect that if I change a dimension(not add) in the drawing that my models are following suit.
All of the engineers I have ever worked with do this the same way.

andrew_troup

The only way you can change a dimension in Onshape Drawings, they are flagged as no longer parametric.
And the engineers I have worked with, particularly those working with complex parts, have not considered it desirable or realistic to be able to edit models from the drawing.
However I would not expect anyone here to be much influenced by that last sentence.
This forum (it seems to me) is a place to argue about ideas brought forward by participants to the forum, not about the preferences of people who are unavailable to explain the reasons for their preferences.