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Cad went back to basement?

3dcad3dcad Member, OS Professional, Mentor Posts: 2,368 PRO
When I found Onshape they had this generous free plan. I felt it was too good to be true but I was delighted that now I could use cad data much more widely than earlier with having only few computers with cad installed. Only few months later I wen't to Pro since I wanted to get the most out of this amazing software and I thought the price is right - it is worth $1200/year for us.

Then I involved few other people in using free plans and shared certain documents with them. I collaborated with our sales and we created new design according to customer needs, then I shared with production so they could look into tooling and machining of parts and finally to customer service so they could grab some images for assembly instructions and get familiar with new product.

I was very happy and thought that we could slowly introduce cad to more and more employees and maybe find some talent who might later become a designer and get justified for Pro account.

Today, cad wen't back to basement data being locked into single user. I suppose I could share my Pro account credentials since others are not really creating anything but then I wouldn't have any control on what they can do and access. Or I could create public link but that is too risky to keep everything open for anyone who gets the link. And the problem with view only link is that there no sketches / dimensions visible, I don't wan't to create drawings just for this purpose. Or I could use something like 3d pdf, but I haven't ever liked 3d pdf since it doesn't feel cad + measuring is crappy.

I would like to raise some discussion on what Professional users need. This is not about complaining lost private docs on free account nor the place asking for middle tier on pricing. I hope admins remove any messages with that stuff.

What would you need to get the most out of Onshape in small company?

A while ago someone already asked for view only accounts that would be used only for viewing models created with Pro. I agree, that would be good and I would like to set them up under same company so that they automatically see all company owned docs and are able to view and measure (access also sketches + dimensions). They should also be able to comment, print drawings - pretty much everything else than editing.

Also if I get more Pro accounts, I would like to be able to set account settings and labels to follow 'company standard'. It is not good to have completely independent accounts so that I need to share docs one by one and they have unique labels and settings. I would like to have sort of sub-pro-account that would be copy of main account but would only see docs owned by company.

Please share any thoughts of Professional use of single / multiple accounts and ideas for new type of accounts.
//rami

Comments

  • billy2billy2 Member, OS Professional, Mentor, Developers Posts: 1,164 PRO
    3dcad-I agree, there needs to be something. I just don't know what it is.

    Maybe only 10 bodies in a partstudio?


  • bruce_williamsbruce_williams Member, Developers Posts: 284 PRO
    3dcad said:

    What would you need to get the most out of Onshape in small company?

    A while ago someone already asked for view only accounts that would be used only for viewing models created with Pro. I agree, that would be good and I would like to set them up under same company so that they automatically see all company owned docs and are able to view and measure (access also sketches + dimensions). They should also be able to comment, print drawings - pretty much everything else than editing.

    Well said @3dcad  I think a few of the things you mention are included for Public accounts in Private Documents - viewing, measure, comment, & print drawings. Also export which is nice...
     
    I agree show dimensions and seeing Company documents is needed.  I also need The 'Public' account to have Import to Private documents.

  • 3dcad3dcad Member, OS Professional, Mentor Posts: 2,368 PRO
    edited December 2016
    @bruce_williams just pointed out one more thing I thought to add here.

    I have invited few customers and suppliers into Onshape so that I could share doc with them and they are able to import models / other stuff for the project and then they are able to follow the progress - some of them have also tried to do something more that was actually my intension in long run - get them into full co-operation and begin usign Onshape.

    Now they are in read only mode (I think ?) so it's as good as shared link (that doesn't require login but has the problems I mentioned earlier). I'm not going to pay anyone else's license fees and I don't wan't to require anyone to use the same system as I do.

    So we are back to email attachments which push also us away from Onshape since double clicking the attached file opens it in installed cad on local computer. I'm not saying this to threat that I'm going back to installed cad (never!), but I'm just too lazy to import everything into Onshape with current procedure and I'm back using installed cad to review dwgs and other that I don't need as part of design.

    This lowers the usage value of Pro and in bigger scale makes Onshape not aware how they could improve their service to cover also this type of usage if there are many others with similar behavior. I mean who will ask for improvement if it's more convenient to use other (existing) cad for certain task?

    billy2 said:
    3dcad-I agree, there needs to be something. I just don't know what it is.
    Maybe only 10 bodies in a partstudio?

    @billy2 ;  Yep, this is not easy task - any easy solution would be open for misuse and too difficult rules would just ruin it.

    I would think some sort of small business pack with simple usage graphics of who is doing what to tell you that you should pay more or if you are in intended use limits.
    //rami
  • owen_sparksowen_sparks Member, Developers Posts: 2,076 PRO
    I'm in a similar but less developed position, and am also interested in what others think.

    I'm the first Pro user in our Production Engineering Department with a further 3 users on the ex free plan with the aim of building up the process and investing in more seats as we get more proficient and demonstrate to our management that OS is an asset within the business.    We're getting into 3D printing and CNC work so CAD is on the up.

    Unfortunately with the changes OS has potentially lost 75+% of our users, as having IP in the public domain is not going to happen, and I can't justify any more seats as it stands.  Also we can't let the new guys learn and grow as they can't now use OS for work, or in working hours.

    Hmmm. :-(

    I was intending working towards electronic build instructions and perhaps BOM's for shop floor operators to work from but am now more worried than ever that the goal posts might move again once that was set up.  I'd love to try to explain to our board why the whole plant is on stop because the cloud based widgets I'd recommended were no longer available / the price has doubled because a plug-in that was free in beta now costs xxx$/month. 

    I'm now leaning back towards writing my own system for such things to retain maximum possible control / insurance against change from outside parties. We've done that for a route-carding system and for all our automated label printing so why not this too?

    I was also looking to spend some time with one operator from each site showing them OS with a view to empowering them to have more say in shop floor layouts jigs etc.  That looks less likely now.

    On the plus side perhaps floating licensees may be an option?  (Our "other" CAD in Engineering and some other non CAD relates software runs this way,  such that we have installed CAD on multiple machines and on startup the SW looks to see how many machines are running and if a the number is less than the total licenses we own it starts, if not it rejects the request...)  Perhaps this might work with OS to allow occasional users to pick from a pot of licenses.

    Will mull more and think again in the new year.

    Owen S,

    Production Engineer
    HWM-Water Ltd
  • michał_1michał_1 Member, Developers Posts: 202 ✭✭✭
     @3dcad I might be missing something but isn't like we still can share private docs with free accounts users, or even share the viewable link?
    Recently I had a discussion if we could write an app/FS  that would link spreadsheets from outside (to be used as user parameters), so people without right permissions could have something like a configurator (like DriveWorks), to play with. But that would be more than just see/print/measure.
  • 3dcad3dcad Member, OS Professional, Mentor Posts: 2,368 PRO
    edited December 2016
    @michal_1
    Yep, sharing is still possible but collaborator can't show dimensions nor access sketches. And sharing docs one by one inside company is quite laborous..
    I like your idea about spreadsheet driven designs through read only account.
    //rami
  • michał_1michał_1 Member, Developers Posts: 202 ✭✭✭
    Again, "teams" are almost what you need. Almost because now after long use, it's going to take a lot of work to share all projects with your team. Nevertheless, the solution is there. Most of the features you're asking are available. Free users and guest users (to some extents) can view, measure, comment, print and export private projects. What is missing are abilities to import data to a private project (if that feature will be provided it should be accessible only to team members) and a feature as simple as "show dimensions" (feature request maybe?).
    In the end, I suspect that the nature of your concern is slightly different you're missing the previous build, where the previous free plan was more favorable than now. Therefore you shouldn't ask admins to remove any references to free account. You're on the same wagon except you don't care if free users are granted any privileges, or if those privileges are yours but shared.
    Another thing is if we could re-define the meaning of an "editable" term. I could imagine that "view only" could allow for changing existing inputs/features, which after session timeouts would vanish, as rolling feature tree bar or evoking old version don't affect original file. It would be like new permission we can give, except "can edit/can't edit" also "can't create" option. I would advocate for replacing view only with "can't create" that would expand possible cooperation, while still be considered a light use.

  • 3dcad3dcad Member, OS Professional, Mentor Posts: 2,368 PRO
    @michał_1
    Yes I'm familiar with teams and I know many things already exist - at least sort of.. What I'm asking here is what we need to make the diamond shine! How do we create flawless workflow without the need to memorize to share each doc etc.. ?

    Like the difference of sharing each file separately between creating shared folder and create everything inside.

    I don't like the idea that I need to share every document inside company.. And I don't like the idea of personal account to each employee which they control on their own - for non-professionals it's better to have 'company' labels and settings so that you can quickly teach them how to inspect something from cad model.

    You have great ideas @michal_1 I hope Onshape is following this. Dividing actions EDIT and CREATE into their own sections would be the solution for me at least.
    If I could allow edit and import rights (not create) to shared docs it would solve all my problems. Collaborator could show dimensions and access sketch and even change dimension or draw the missing line / fix some constraint and could also edit extrusion but wouldn't be able to create new sketch / extrusion - just perfect!

    I think this woud be the ultimate solution that is still unable to use in a way that single pro license is used to empower whole team.

    Can we get Onshape comments on this idea? @scott_harris @lougallo
    //rami
  • _Ðave__Ðave_ Member, Developers Posts: 712 ✭✭✭
    I would like the ability to use the follow me mode with a customer on a free account without having to make a document public.
  • 3dcad3dcad Member, OS Professional, Mentor Posts: 2,368 PRO
    Six months later, any new ideas?
    //rami
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